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sneffelsjokull
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xx Z - EOS adapter?
« Thread started on: May 24th, 2012, 08:08am »

Hello, new member here and thank you for this wonderful resource on Mamiya.
I have recently acquired a Mamiya-Sekor E 50mm/1.7 in very good condition and would like to try it on my Canon 5D.

Just wondering if there is a Z - EOS adapter and if not what options are available for mounting to EOS.

thank you
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Dustin H.
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xx Re: Z - EOS adapter?
« Reply #1 on: May 24th, 2012, 1:53pm »

The problem with the ZE (E-series) lenses is that the aperture ring isn't directly connected to the diaphragm. This means, even if you could get it to mount with an adapter, and even if you could get it to achieve infinity focus, you'd have no way of controlling the aperture. Depending on the adapter, it would either have to be shot at its widest or smallest aperture. It just isn't practical to attempt mounting E lenses on anything other than a Mamiya Z-series camera, unfortunately. I wish this were possible, considering the extensive collection of E-series glass I've accumulated...
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sneffelsjokull
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xx Re: Z - EOS adapter?
« Reply #2 on: May 24th, 2012, 8:51pm »

Thanks for the reply, I partially dissasembled the back- end of the lens and noticed there is not mechanical linkage between the aperture ring and the diaphram. Is the aperture controlled electronically thru the contacts on the back of the lens?

Pitys, as I would have liked to see how the lens performed.

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Dustin H.
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xx Re: Z - EOS adapter?
« Reply #3 on: May 24th, 2012, 9:38pm »

I honestly am unsure how the aperture is controlled by the body. I don't think it's through the electrical contacts... there just isn't much connected to them. They were apparently intended for future use on some future camera body which never came to be. For instance, the ZE camera body only uses 3 of the contacts. The ZE-2 uses 6 (the additional ones tell the camera what the lowest acceptable hand-held shutter speed is for a given lens.)

On top of all this, the ZE and ZE-2 cameras can still function manually, without electrical power, as long as the shutter speed is set to X. This means the aperture must be controllable without the use of electricity.

I've always assumed the aperture is controlled directly by the coupling which touches the diaphragm lever on the lens. The camera body has an aperture feeler around the outer edge of the lens mount, which couples to the aperture ring in the same way Nikon AI lenses couple to their bodies. I'm guessing this controls how far the body pushes the diaphragm coupling, based on how far the feeler is pushed by the aperture ring.

Any of you other, more experienced guys out there have an answer for this?

I don't really understand how it works-- Mamiya E lenses are the only manual-focus lenses I've ever seen which don't have a direct connection. The reason they're made this way is that the ZE-X camera (and I assume others which never came to fruition) had a built in crossover network. When turned on, this wonderful invention can override your pre-set aperture if lighting conditions aren't adequate for the aperture you've chosen. Thus, you can shoot in aperture priority with automatic "error correction." The camera just pushes your aperture setting to the nearest adequate setting. (I wish modern D-SLR's had this ability!)

At any rate, no mounting adapter exists for the E-series lenses. Even if one could be made, the flange-to-film distance of the E lenses is such that most cameras couldn't achieve infinity focus without modifying the lens itself. There are people out there who have destructively modified E lenses to work on EOS cameras--Google would probably turn them up.

--Dustin H.
« Last Edit: May 24th, 2012, 9:41pm by Dustin H. » User IP Logged

slackadocious
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xx Re: Z - EOS adapter?
« Reply #4 on: May 25th, 2012, 09:14am »

Heres a guy who "destructively modified" his E lens. It can be done but it doesnt look easy or ideal.

http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=47942&sid=36cc9a779a78ceb086bca4c0a5863090#1215241

At the time the Z series came out Mamiya was way ahead of the 35mm pack. Unlike most previous lenses, which were purely mechanical and largely based on the pentax/M42 style of operation, the E lenses were a huge departure using a totally unique combination of electronics and new mechanics to make things work.


The z series lens apertures are operated by moving the lever on the lens side to side (laterally) where CS and the earlier M42 lenses use an aperture pin that is operated in line with the image path of the lens (longitudinally). On CS / m42 glass adapters can simply depress the aperture pin to operate the diaphragm, but the Z cameras took a totally unique approach, moving away from the m42 style pin to the lateral lever discussed below.

The Z series bodies have a small hammer/flange that pops out and strikes the lever on the lens to operate the aperture when you release the shutter.

More specifically, E lenses communicate the lens's aperture ring setting, via the electrical contacts, to the camera body's "computer" (hardly qualifies in the modern sense). Then when the shutter is released, according to the value passed electronically, the hammer/lever in the body pops out just far enough to stop the lens down to that value.

Because the lens is operated this way, as Dustin mentioned, even if you destructively mod the lens, and fit it to a EOS body, it will take additional mods and considerable handy-work to get the aperture to operate in any meaningful way.

M42 lenses can be fitted to EOS bodies with very inexpensive adapters sold out of china, found all over ebay.
Because of the wide availability of m42 adapters, a lot of M42 glass for sale online has inflated prices as compared to the less-standard CS lenses, which are m42 style operation, but use a proprietary bayonet instead of standard m42 (1x42mm) threads.


If you want to shoot Mamiya glass, and cheaply, 2nd or 3rd hand CS glass is about as cheap as E glass and nearly identical in terms of optics. CS glass CAN be adapted to EOS bodies with my CS to EOS adapter found here:
http://www.shapeways.com/shops/polymetric

side note... seriously Dustin, how many times do you think we will have to answer this question tongue
« Last Edit: May 25th, 2012, 09:16am by slackadocious » User IP Logged

3D Printed Mamiya CS to EOS adapter ( http://shpws.me/llIh )
3D Printed Mamiya NC1000 P-Mount ( http://shpws.me/lmrA )
sneffelsjokull
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xx Re: Z - EOS adapter?
« Reply #5 on: May 25th, 2012, 09:22am »

Thanks for the detailed info regarding Z series camersa and E series lens. I think it might have to go in the 'too hard' basket for now.

Sorry for not searching the forum for similiar previous questions smiley
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Dustin H.
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xx Re: Z - EOS adapter?
« Reply #6 on: May 25th, 2012, 6:47pm »

That's okay sneffelsjokull-- It's something we'd all probably like to do. I'd definitely like to use my E glass on digital, but it just won't happen.

slackadocious-- I would guess this won't be the last! smiley
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